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David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 #187725
11/01/18 12:58 PM
11/01/18 12:58 PM
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Charity  Offline OP
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David Gates, president of Gospel Ministries International, a supporting Adventist ministry, released a video on You Tube a week or two ago (mid October 2018) that sounds an alarm to get ready for a major event within Adventism and the world in March or April 2019. He is convinced that God will enter into judgment with Adventism. I have had the same conviction for some time - that God is indeed about to test Adventism this spring at a new level that will result soon afterward in the outpouring of the latter rain.

As he anticipated many have already leveled the charge of time setting but in my view this is not time-proclamation but a call to prayer and self-examination, humility and repentance like in the time of the apostles. Before the early rain was poured out the Lord told the disciples to wait for it and as they waited they were to prepare for it. Christ didn't specify the day that the Spirit would be poured out but the disciples, being Jews and seeing that Christ had been slain on Passover and rose on the Feast of First Fruits no doubt viewed the next spring feast as a most probable time for the divine outpouring.

Below, in point form I've summarized the scriptural evidence that in the same way favors this spring.

1. The only bible prophecy that Christ while on earth directly admonished us to read and understand is Daniel's regarding the abomination of desolation.
2. Ellen White also urges us like Christ to study the warning in Daniel 12 because we need to understand it better than we do.
3. Because Daniel 9, like Daniel 8 and 12, warns of the abomination it must also be central to Christ's warning and apply especially to the end.
4. Daniel 9 was fulfilled originally in type in the last half of Zechariah 6. The crowning of Joshua the high priest as the Branch points to the true fulfillment, the glorification of Christ in His people during the final outpouring of the Spirit.
5. The division of the 69 weeks into two segments of 7 and 62 has no historic fulfillment. No one knows at this point in time exactly how it will be fulfilled but it appears to be a key to understanding the onset of the latter rain in this way: The church will appear as though it is about to fall but God will overrule and out of Zion God will issue the command to restore it. The anointing of Daniel 9 at the end of the seventh literal week points especially to the church during the latter rain.
6. Other key elements of Daniel 9 also clearly apply to the end-time. “Everlasting righteousness” is promised to the spotless bride of Christ. The end of “sin and transgression” in the church of God is promised before the close of probation. (Daniel 9:24). Daniel 9:24-27 should be read like this:

Quote:
Dan 9:24 Seventy weeks [that is seventy Jubilees which are seventy seven year Sabbaticals, see below] are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Dan 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that [once this period of Jubilees is fulfilled] from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build [spiritual] Jerusalem [the church] unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven [literal] weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times [during the 'little time of trouble.']
Dan 9:26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, [this is the same event as the slaying of the two witnesses of Revelation 11:7 and the scattering of the power of the holy people of Daniel 12:7] but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, [a national Sunday law] and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
Dan 9:27 And [during the judgment of the living] he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, [at the slaying of the two witnesses] and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined [the seven last plagues] shall be poured upon the desolate.


7. This saying of Christ, “until seventy times seven,” describes the limit of divine forbearance. It was an intentional, prophetic reference to the seventy times seven of Daniel 9.
8. The seventy weeks of Daniel 9 applies to all of God's people, Jew and gentile, in this way - as Sabbaticals. This is consistent with the Hebrew word for week which, according to Strongs, is literally “sevened”. Seventy times seven is 490 Sabbaticals or 70 Jubilees. This period of 3430 years is the probationary time of Spiritual Israel. The count of the Sabbatical years began when Israel entered the promised land in 1416 BC and ended 3431 years later in 2015. 1416 minus 3431 years (3430 years plus one to account for the missing transition year from BC to AD) is 2015. In my opinion, the judgment of the living began in that year.
9. In July of 2015 the Ellen White Estate released all the remaining unpublished manuscripts of Sister White. Among them was this prediction:
“I am now of the opinion that the Testimonies will not live among God’s people. They will be removed. I have some light on this point but cannot now give it. Said Christ, “I have many things to say unto you but ye cannot bear them now.” {Lt16-1875}
At the same time this prophecy was released it was fulfilled in part by the General Conference held July 2 to 11, 2015 in San Antonio, Texas where it was voted to remove the phrase “source of truth” in reference to her writings. It was further fulfilled at the same session following the vote that reaffirmed the non-ordination of women, when the North American Division, the NAD, openly declared its intention to disregard the vote. Since that time the NAD has been in open rebellion. This is clearly contrary to the counsel of Ellen White that the voted actions of the GC ought to be respected. The General Conference by failing to hold the NAD accountable has also disregarded her counsel. God will not permit this to go indefinitely.
10. In the fall of 66 AD Rome briefly besieged Jerusalem. The early Christians heeding the warning of Christ regarding the abomination of desolation fled Jerusalem knowing that Rome would return. Three and a half years later Rome did return and destroyed the city but none of the Christians perished in the siege. Similarly, at the close of the 70th Jubilee on September 24, 2015 Pope Francis stood before congress and was embraced by all three branches of America's government. In the spring of 2019, 3.5 years later Rome may well return again.
11. In April 2015 Francis issued a Papal Bull of indiction, Misericordiae Vultus (Latin: "The Face of Mercy"), inaugurating a Special Jubilee of Mercy, to run from 8 December 2015 to 20 November 2016. Wikipedia states: “The Holy Doors of the major basilicas of Rome (including the Great Door of St. Peter's) were opened, and special "Doors of Mercy" were opened at cathedrals and other major churches around the world, where the faithful could earn indulgences by fulfilling the usual conditions of prayer for the Pope's intentions, confession, and detachment from sin, and communion. During Lent of that year, special 24-hour penance services were celebrated, and during the year, special qualified and experienced priests called "Missionaries of Mercy" were available in every diocese to forgive even severe, special-case sins normally reserved to the Holy See's Apostolic Penitentiary.” This was in fulfillment of the prediction by the Apostle that at the time of the falling away the man of sin would be revealed as sitting in the temple of God showing himself that he is God. This was another indication that we are in the judgment of the living and the time of the falling away of God's people both Adventist and Catholic.
12. Ellen White tells us that at the beginning of the time of trouble “we were filled with the Holy Ghost and went forth to proclaim the Sabbath more fully.” Early Writings 33.2. If the 1260 days of the abomination of desolation begins this spring, the outpouring of the spirit will follow soon after.
13. The scattering or breaking of the power of the holy people at the end of the 1260 days in Daniel 12 by the abomination of desolation is the same event as the silencing of the two witnesses at the end of the 1260 days in Revelation 11. Christ applied this to the end. Ellen White also applies both to the end. A further evidence of a literal 1260 days is that unlike the earlier prophecies of Daniel which are given in symbols the prophecy of Daniel 10 through 12 is literal so the periods are also literal.
14. Referring to the seven thunders of Revelation 10 Ellen White says, “These relate to future events which will be disclosed in their order. Daniel shall stand in his lot at the end of the days.” There is a direct connection between the oath of Michael regarding the 1260 days and the scattering of the power of the holy people in Daniel 12 and the sounding of the seven thunders because Michael of Daniel 12 and the mighty angel of Revelation 10 are the same Person who utters the same oath, Jesus Christ.

Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: Charity] #187726
11/01/18 02:10 PM
11/01/18 02:10 PM
Daryl  Online Canadian

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Nova Scotia, Canada
I would be very careful of following what a person is saying over what the Bible is saying and over what EGW is also saying bearing in mind that the writings of EGW are the lesser light leading to the Greater Light (the Scriptures).

Quote:
“I am now of the opinion that the Testimonies will not live among God’s people. They will be removed. I have some light on this point but cannot now give it. Said Christ, “I have many things to say unto you but ye cannot bear them now.” {Lt16-1875}
At the same time this prophecy was released it was fulfilled in part by the General Conference held July 2 to 11, 2015 in San Antonio, Texas where it was voted to remove the phrase “source of truth” in reference to her writings.

They didn't simply remove the words "source of truth" but replaced them with even stronger wording, "speak with prophetic authority".

Compare the wording of the 2010 Church Manual with the 2015 Church Manual:

From the "2010 Church Manual":

18. The Gift of Prophecy

"One of the gifts of the Holy Spirit is prophecy. This gift is an identifying mark of the remnant church and was manifested in the ministry of Ellen G. White. As the Lord's messenger, her writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction. They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested. (Joel 2:28, 29; Acts 2:14-21; Heb. 1:1-3; Rev. 12:17; 19:10.)" (2010 Manual, p.2010)

From the "2015 Church Manual":

18. The Gift of Prophecy

"The Scriptures testify that one of the gifts of the Holy Spirit is prophecy. This gift is an identifying mark of the remnant church and we believe it was manifested in the ministry of Ellen G. White. Her writings speak with prophetic authority and provide comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction to the church. They also make clear that the Bible is the standard by which all teaching and experience must be tested. (Num. 12:6; 2 Chron. 20:20; Amos 3:7; Joel 2:28, 29; Acts 2:14-21; 2 Tim. 3:16, 17; Heb. 1:1-3; Rev. 12:17; 19:10; 22:8, 9.") (2015 Manual, p.168)


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: Charity] #187727
11/01/18 02:12 PM
11/01/18 02:12 PM
Daryl  Online Canadian

Site Administrator
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,122
Nova Scotia, Canada
I would be careful of people who present what I would refer to as half truths, which David Gates seems to have done in reference to the change in the Church Manual from my previous post.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: Charity] #187735
11/02/18 02:57 PM
11/02/18 02:57 PM
Green Cochoa  Offline
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Posts: 7,003
The Orient
I would side with those who see the newer language as tamer. "Authoritative source of truth" is stronger, to my view, than simply "prophetic authority." The latter, by omitting "source of truth" as well as "authoritative," leaves the status of the prophet more generally to be determined by the individual.

We all know there will be some true prophets and many false prophets. To say, therefore, "prophetic authority," says little--for every prophet may make claims to this.

The question is, "Why change it?"

Jesus tells us "I AM the Way, the Truth, and the Life." Truth is vital. The great controversy hinges upon and battles over the question of what is truth. To remove a direct reference to Ellen White's testimonies as being a source of truth is misguided at best, and outright sinister at worst.

Originally Posted By: The Holy Bible
Remove not the ancient landmark, which thy fathers have set. (Proverbs 22:28, KJV)

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: Daryl] #187737
11/03/18 12:34 AM
11/03/18 12:34 AM
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Charity  Offline OP
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Originally Posted By: Daryl
I would be careful of people who present what I would refer to as half truths, which David Gates seems to have done in reference to the change in the Church Manual from my previous post.


The change in wording at San Antonio was driven by a misguided desire to ensure that we are not viewed as placing Ellen White's writings on par with scripture. Bible believing Adventists do not use her writings to establish or define doctrine. But her writings are in fact an authoritative source of truth because according to scripture we are not to despise the prophetic gift. This was a very significant and unbiblical change. Gates is correct and time will tell what results flow from the change and how this was a significant fulfillment of her prediction of the death of the testimonies.

This change is one of the strongest evidences that Adventism is in the judgment of the living. In the world, probation lingers during the testimony of the two witnesses. The slaying of the two witnesses marks the end of probation for it. Their murder occurs in Sodom and Egypt. In the church the two witnesses are wounded and crucified in the house of Christ's friends. It is when the church turns a deaf ear to the Holy Spirit speaking through the testimonies that the two witnesses cease to live among us. This slaying of the two witnesses reached a new level in San Antonio. God is measuring us.

Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: Charity] #187741
11/03/18 12:17 PM
11/03/18 12:17 PM
His child  Offline
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I was blessed by David's video message in that he reinforces the message to study and get ready. Thanks for posting the link


"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: Green Cochoa] #187742
11/03/18 12:37 PM
11/03/18 12:37 PM
Rick H  Offline
Group: Admin Team
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,121
Florida, USA
Originally Posted By: Green Cochoa
I would side with those who see the newer language as tamer. "Authoritative source of truth" is stronger, to my view, than simply "prophetic authority." The latter, by omitting "source of truth" as well as "authoritative," leaves the status of the prophet more generally to be determined by the individual.

We all know there will be some true prophets and many false prophets. To say, therefore, "prophetic authority," says little--for every prophet may make claims to this.

The question is, "Why change it?"

Jesus tells us "I AM the Way, the Truth, and the Life." Truth is vital. The great controversy hinges upon and battles over the question of what is truth. To remove a direct reference to Ellen White's testimonies as being a source of truth is misguided at best, and outright sinister at worst.

Originally Posted By: The Holy Bible
Remove not the ancient landmark, which thy fathers have set. (Proverbs 22:28, KJV)

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


I think there are many concerned Adventist and good Christians that would like to see something major happen, but hoping something will happen doesn't make it so. I would agree with your statement that "To remove a direct reference to Ellen White's testimonies as being a source of truth is misguided at best, and outright sinister at worst."

Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: Rick H] #187743
11/03/18 10:27 PM
11/03/18 10:27 PM
His child  Offline
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Posts: 1,673
TN, USA
Originally Posted By: Rick H


I think there are many concerned Adventist and good Christians that would like to see something major happen, but hoping something will happen doesn't make it so. I would agree with your statement that "To remove a direct reference to Ellen White's testimonies as being a source of truth is misguided at best, and outright sinister at worst."


The timing might be right for an American President to be impeached or for Iran to attack America's fleet in the Gulf?

When prophecy is fulfilled we will know: By their fulfillment Daniel and Revelation will explain themselves.

Last edited by His child; 11/03/18 10:28 PM.

"Ignorance is sin, when knowledge can be obtained" (HR, September 1, 1866 par. 3). www.loudcry101.com
Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: Rick H] #187747
11/04/18 12:35 AM
11/04/18 12:35 AM
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glenm  Offline
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Colorado, USA
One thing I noticed is that he says that the Day of Atonement is September 23 in 2015.

The Jewish calendar runs in a 19-year cycle called the "Metonic Cycle", and the 171 years from 1844 to 2015 is exactly nine of these cycles (9 x 19).

So the actual Day of Atonement in 2015 would be a month later, approximately October 22 or 23.

This doesn't match the standard Jewish calendar, but the same was true in 1844.

Re: David Gates' prediction re Spring 2019 [Re: glenm] #187752
11/05/18 01:28 PM
11/05/18 01:28 PM
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Charity  Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2001
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USA
Originally Posted By: glenm
The Jewish calendar runs in a 19-year cycle called the "Metonic Cycle", and the 171 years from 1844 to 2015 is exactly nine of these cycles (9 x 19).

So the actual Day of Atonement in 2015 would be a month later, approximately October 22 or 23.


That's a very good and valid observation and I agree that the actual Day of Atonement in 2015 was a month later. I was aware of that in 2015 as well and it wouldn't surprise me if Gates is also aware of this. Regardless, Gates is correct that we witnessed a prophetic fulfillment September 23 and 24. The great majority of the Jews were observing their Yom Kippur on the 23rd when the Pope met President Obama at the White House and spoke to thousands on the White House lawn. On the following day he addressed and was embraced by all three branches of American government, Legislative, Judicial and Executive, another major fulfillment. Our leaders who ought to know better blinded their eyes to the sinister designs and deadly errors of the Papacy, an institution that places a man on the throne of deity. On that day they denied the American motto, "In God we Trust" and America through its leaders wondered after the beast.


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