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Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47383
05/06/06 06:15 PM
05/06/06 06:15 PM
A
Anonymous
Unregistered

Quote:

Hello Darius,

"This, BTW, is why EGW stopped advancing the Shut Door theory. She simply admitted she was wrong on that score."

Please provide the source or reference where EGW admitted she was wrong in advancing the Shut Door theory.

Thank you ,

Gordon


When one stops advocating a particular view then the conclusion is obvious without the formal statement.

Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47384
05/06/06 09:28 PM
05/06/06 09:28 PM
Daryl  Offline
OP
Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,123
Nova Scotia, Canada
Sorry, Darius, that doesn't cut it with me, therefore, I disagree with your statement that EGW "simply admitted she was wrong on that score" as, if that were true, she would have clearly said so.

Darius, I must also state that you seem to think that you have all the answers, that if you think something to be so that it is so for the reason that what you state here, you state so dogmatically. That is how you come across to us here, and to me particularly. I don't know why you are like this, but like this is how I perceive you to be.

Getting back on topic, I just finished watching and listening to a message of 3ABN on Exodus 20:14, "Thou shalt not commit adultery", in which he stated that polygamy is clearly a sin.

Of course, as I think was already posted here, EGW also, under inspiration, clearly wrote that polygamy is clearly a sin.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47385
05/07/06 02:30 PM
05/07/06 02:30 PM
Darius  Offline
Dedicated Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
Daryl, you have to consider the value of believing that EGW did not admit that she was wrong on the Shut Door and also stopped teaching it while advocating the very opposite to it. That is your call.

I don't advance anything for which I do not have strong evidentiary support. I preach no dogma because everything I advance is subject to scrutiny. If you can show that I am wrong then you are free to do so but it has never been a hallmark of sound human progress to judge the validity of an idea simply because it negates accepted views.

I also heard the sermon by Lomacong. It was interesting the way he hurried over the statement. He believes it but he knows he can't support it. I have a higher standard for truth.


Darius A. Lecointe, J.D., Ph.D.
No weapon formed against me shall prosper.
Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47386
05/07/06 08:04 PM
05/07/06 08:04 PM
Daryl  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,123
Nova Scotia, Canada
In that case, Darius, show us your strong evidentiary support.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47387
05/07/06 09:02 PM
05/07/06 09:02 PM
Darius  Offline
Dedicated Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
After the first polygamist was recorded in the Bible the creator had ample opportunity to make His feelings on the subject known. He said nothing. In fact, many more of his spokesmen openly practiced polygamy with not a word from the creator. That is sufficient, but it is here I am struck by the irony. We wish to claim that polygamy is a sin but have no problems accepting it when it is done serially under the name of divorce and remarriage. Polygamy is not wanton sexual behavior and it preserves the dignity of those involved.


Darius A. Lecointe, J.D., Ph.D.
No weapon formed against me shall prosper.
Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47388
05/07/06 09:47 PM
05/07/06 09:47 PM
Daryl  Offline
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Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,123
Nova Scotia, Canada
Now we are getting somewhere by having something tangible to look at and discuss.

I did a word search, and, as far as I can determine, this is the first instance of what we refer to today as polygamy:

Quote:


Gen. 16:3 And Sarai, Abram's wife, took Hagar the Egyptian, her handmaid, after Abram had dwelt ten years in the land of Canaan, and gave her to Abram her husband to be his wife.




Now, the question is, was this a sinful act that was done in this instance?


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47389
05/07/06 10:07 PM
05/07/06 10:07 PM
Daryl  Offline
OP
Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,123
Nova Scotia, Canada
After doing some reading and reflecting upon this, I have another question to ask, namely, that if this wasn't a sinful act, then did God approve of this?


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47390
05/07/06 10:20 PM
05/07/06 10:20 PM
Darius  Offline
Dedicated Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
There is no indication that the Creator disapproved of it. The problems that arose were not because of the practice but because of the people involved. The same is true of monogamous marriages. There was no sin involved in the act itself. She gave her to him to be his wife.


Darius A. Lecointe, J.D., Ph.D.
No weapon formed against me shall prosper.
Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47391
05/07/06 10:38 PM
05/07/06 10:38 PM
Daryl  Offline
OP
Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,123
Nova Scotia, Canada
As I hold to the fact that God inspired the writings of EGW, I decided to do a "polygamy" word search of her writings and came up 44 times in which this word was used by her.

Here are one of these:

Quote:


Chap. 30 - Marrying and Giving in Marriage

In the days that were before the flood they were . . . marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark. Matt. 24:38. {Conflict and Courage 36.1}

In Noah's day brute force was the prevailing influence in the world. By threatened punishment, men intimidated other men. {CC 36.2}

Instead of doing justice to their neighbors, they carried out their own unlawful wishes. They had a plurality of wives, which was contrary to God's wise arrangement. In the beginning God gave to Adam one wife--showing to all who should live upon the earth, his order and law in that respect. The transgression and fall of Adam and Eve brought sin and wretchedness upon the human race, and man followed his own carnal desires, and changed God's order. The more men multiplied wives to themselves, the more they increased in wickedness and unhappiness. If one chose to take the wives, or cattle, or anything belonging to his neighbor, he did not regard justice or right but if he could prevail over his neighbor by reason of strength, or by putting him to death, he did so, and exulted in his deeds of violence. They loved to destroy the lives of animals. They used them for food, and this increased their ferocity and violence, and caused them to look upon the blood of human beings with astonishing indifference. {CC 36.3}

The descendants of Seth were called the sons of God; the descendants of Cain, the sons of men. As the sons of God mingled with the sons of men, they became corrupt and, by intermarriage with them, lost, through the influence of their wives, their peculiar, holy character, and united with the sons of Cain in their idolatry. Many cast aside the fear of God and trampled upon His commandments. But there were a few that did righteousness, who feared and honored their Creator. Noah and his family were among the righteous few. {CC 36.4}

Polygamy was practiced at an early date. It was one of the sins that brought the wrath of God upon the antediluvian world. . . . It was Satan's studied effort to pervert the marriage institution, to weaken its obligations and lessen its sacredness; for in no surer way could he deface the image of God in man and open the door to misery and vice. {CC 36.5}




In the above quote EGW wrote under inspiration that polygamy was one of the sins that brought the wrath of God upon the antediluvian world.

Here is another EGW quote pertaining specifically to what I saw as the first recorded instance of polygamy in the Bible:

Quote:


Abraham had accepted without question the promise of a son, but he did not wait for God to fulfill His word in His own time and way. A delay was permitted, to test his faith in the power of God; but he failed to endure the trial. Thinking it impossible that a child should be given her in her old age, Sarah suggested, as a plan by which the divine purpose might be fulfilled, that one of her handmaidens should be taken by Abraham as a secondary wife. Polygamy had become so widespread that it had ceased to be regarded as a sin, but it was no less a violation of the law of God, and was fatal to the sacredness and peace of the family relation. Abraham's marriage with Hagar resulted in evil, not only to his own household, but to future generations. . . .{Daughters of God 27.1}




Are we to ignore the above quotes?
My answer is a resounding no, as I see this as inspired evidence that polygamy is indeed a sin that was one of the reasons of The Flood and will also be one of the reasons for The Lake of Fire.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: Is "Polygamy" a Sin? #47392
05/08/06 01:01 AM
05/08/06 01:01 AM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
I think they may be a tendency to look at these quotes as if they are saying:
a)Polygamy is bad because God doesn't like it.
b)In fact, God disliked it so much, that it made so angry, He sent a flood to deal with those who were doing it.

The right way seeing this is given here:

Quote:

Polygamy had become so widespread that it had ceased to be regarded as a sin, but it was no less a violation of the law of God, and was fatal to the sacredness and peace of the family relation. Abraham's marriage with Hagar resulted in evil, not only to his own household, but to future generations.




which is to say, polygamy was bad because:
a)It is fatal to the sacredness and peace of the family relation.
b)It results in evil, not only in the present generation, but in following generations.

In other words, God hates polygamy because it is bad, not the other way around.

The wrath of God is His allowing the consequences to come from the choices which are made, not something arbitrary which God does to wreak havoc upon those who do things contrary to His intentions. Doing things contrary to His intentions bring their own havoc, because only the principles of God's government can bring peace, love and happiness.


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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