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Re: Guidelines For Keeping The Sabbath Holy
#49160
10/17/03 12:24 PM
10/17/03 12:24 PM
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Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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quote:
Originally posted by Avalee:
This is so very very sad to see this from your heart...these GUIDELINES DO NOT say you have to do this or die. These are just simple GUIDELINES. I am so very very very sorry you feel like this towards being ready for God. I do not have sundown Vespers on Friday or Sabbath. Am I breaking a rule? No because there is not RULE to break. I am sorry but I have to tell you that you are being pretty silly here.
If they are just guidelines, why would they then negatively affect me being ready for God? Why does it break your heart that I called this list RULES? It sounds like you see me as eternally lost, or at least that you see me as having a strange/eccentric/difficult faith, for not sharing your view on these, is that the way to relate to guidelines? Just something to think about...
It is possible that I am acting silly here, I admit. A silly problem just requires a silly sollution, dont you think?
/Thomas
/ps If these rules had been an living being, i would probably have suffered from an exagerated view of its own importance, first for being posted, secoundly for being debated...
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Re: Guidelines For Keeping The Sabbath Holy
#49161
10/17/03 09:54 PM
10/17/03 09:54 PM
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 2,019
Northern CA
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I guess you see these suggestions as one way and I see them another way. I choose to see them as just suggestions and you choose to see them as rules. This is what I think is sad. You have put an intent into this thread that was not there. It has not been posted to tell people what to do.... Now you have mention this part below about Friday vespers for instance: quote:
This RULE for instance tells you how you should do friday vespers, and that in a quite exact way, this doesnt look like a guideline or suggestion, it looks like a RULE "* The Friday evening worship in your home should be brief a song or two, a short Scripture reading, and short prayers by all."
Now I am not sure if you believe in the Spirit of Prophecy or not but whoever wrote those simple guidelines for being ready for the Sabbath took alot of it from the Spirit of Prophecy and just put it in their own words. Take what the Spirit of Prophecy has said about this one thing about Vespers you are troubled about:
quote:
Testimonies For The Church
Page 356
Before the setting of the sun let the members of the family assemble to read God's word, to sing and pray. There is need of reform here, for many have been remiss.
Now this has been given to us from the Spirit of Prophecy...it is saying the same thing this person who wrote these guidelines....
Again all I can say is I am sorry that you feel the way you do. No one has tried to tell you what to do...that is not anyones business but God's. Plese do not try to read into something that is meant to be very simple. ![[Heart]](graemlins/heart.gif)
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Re: Guidelines For Keeping The Sabbath Holy
#49162
10/19/03 03:14 AM
10/19/03 03:14 AM
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 221
USA
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I wonder if a condensed copy of the "guidelines" could be prepared so that it could be carried in a purse or pocket for easy referal to make sure compliance is accomplished each week. Maybe we should also have a long list of guidelines to make sure our relationshhip with our children is what it should be, as well as one for our spouse, and our parents,etc. I believe in the Spirit of Prophecy because the advise given was practical for the time in which it was given, keeping in mind that there are principles behind the guidelines. The principles never change. The rules or guidelines do. For instance, I would suggest that the reason for the guideline to complete bathing before Sabbath was because of the time and effort necessary to prepare for bathing. You had to start a fire on the stove to heat the water, drag in a tub to put the warm water in, each take a turn in the same tub, carry the "used" water outside to dispose of it, and then clean up the spilled water on the floor. Not a very inspiring time. When I shower now, I turn on a handle, bath, dry off, and sing songs while doing so. No big deal. Can you see a difference? How about ironing? You know what was needed to prepare for ironing about 100 years ago. Somewhat diffrent than now, huh? What about food preperation? Any difference?
You know, just as my actions to deveolpe a "perfect" relationship with my spouse may be diffrent than your actions to develope that relationship with your spouse, maybe my actions in developing that relationship with Christ may be diffrent than your actions. It is a heart thing. Look at the principles, just like Jesus did, not the guidelines of yesteryear. That may lead to a more enjoyable and profitable Sabbath experience.
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Re: Guidelines For Keeping The Sabbath Holy
#49163
10/18/03 09:57 PM
10/18/03 09:57 PM
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Active Member 2011
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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Hi Avalee I see that you did choose to ignore my last reply... Id just want to comment on the vespers quote that you did take up. I have nothing against vespers, I however have some doubts about "GUIDELINES"/checklists that tell you quite specifilcly how you should do it. As of my view of the Spirit of Prophesy, yes, I belive in Him. Jesus said this about Him, JOhn 16 quote:
5"Now I am going to him who sent me, yet none of you asks me, 'Where are you going?' 6Because I have said these things, you are filled with grief. 7But I tell you the truth: It is for your good that I am going away. Unless I go away, the Counselor will not come to you; but if I go, I will send him to you. 8When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt[1] in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment: 9in regard to sin, because men do not believe in me; 10in regard to righteousness, because I am going to the Father, where you can see me no longer; 11and in regard to judgment, because the prince of this world now stands condemned.
12"I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. 13But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. 14He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. 15All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you.
16"In a little while you will see me no more, and then after a little while you will see me."
Your quote, I assume, comes from Ellen White who had the gift of prophesy. Many of her books include these prophesies, though I cannot say for sure about all of them due to lack of knowledge.
This might have confused things even more. Perhaps DrD's post is clearer. I found it good.
/Thomas
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Re: Guidelines For Keeping The Sabbath Holy
#49164
10/18/03 10:11 PM
10/18/03 10:11 PM
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 2,019
Northern CA
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All I can say is that we shall have to agree to disagree on how we see these guidelines....I have never looked at anything that pertains to God as rules, lists, guidelines...or whatever the word may be. I pray that each and everyday I come closer to my Lord and Saviour. Being ready for the Sabbath does not make me sad, hurried, or whatever. All week my mind is on the Sabbath Day and what needs to be done in order for the time to be God's and God's only. Which means if something needs to be ironed it will be ironed before Sabbath begins and if it does not get ironed then it will not be worn. Praise God for his Word in the Scriptures and the Spirit of Prophecy to guide us through this world...whoops there is that nasty word "guide" you guys do not like... ![[Big Grin]](images/icons/grin.gif) Lest anyone thinks God is not serious about us obeying what He has told us to do...well just ask Adam and Eve if God is serious...they did not think He was I guess...all He told them to do was not eat of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil...simple guideline to having eternal life...whoops there is that nasty word again you so much dislike... And no I am not saying that the Guideline list that was posted was from God..so don't go getting all excited again.
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Re: Guidelines For Keeping The Sabbath Holy
#49165
10/18/03 11:34 PM
10/18/03 11:34 PM
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OP
Charter Member
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Was just reading in the Testimonies for the Church that God has given us to guide us through this world and was so blessed by reading what He gave to His prophet to give to us in the last days. Amen Below are just a few quotes from this chapter. quote:
Great blessings are enfolded in the observance of the Sabbath, and God desires that the Sabbath day shall be to us a day of joy. There was joy at the institution of the Sabbath. God looked with satisfaction upon the work of His hands. All things that He had made He pronounced "very good." Genesis 1:31. Heaven and earth were filled with rejoicing. "The morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy." Job 38:7. Though sin has entered the world to mar His perfect work, God still gives to us the Sabbath as a witness that One omnipotent, infinite in goodness and mercy, created all things. Our heavenly Father desires through the observance of the Sabbath to preserve among men a knowledge of Himself. He desires that the Sabbath shall direct our minds to Him as the true and living God, and that through knowing Him we may have life and peace.
quote:
To us as to Israel the Sabbath is given "for a perpetual covenant." To those who reverence His holy day the Sabbath is a sign that God recognizes them as His chosen people. It is a pledge that He will fulfill to them His covenant. Every soul who accepts the sign of God's government places himself under the divine, everlasting covenant. He fastens himself to the golden chain of obedience, every link of which is a promise.
quote:
Far more sacredness is attached to the Sabbath than is given it by many professed Sabbathkeepers. The Lord has been greatly dishonored by those who have not kept the Sabbath according to the commandment, either in the letter or in the spirit. He calls for a reform in the observance of the Sabbath.
quote:
All through the week we are to have the Sabbath in mind and be making preparation to keep it according to the commandment. We are not merely to observe the Sabbath as a legal matter. We are to understand its spiritual bearing upon all the transactions of life. All who regard the Sabbath as a sign between them and God, showing that He is the God who sanctifies them, will represent the principles of His government. They will bring into daily practice the laws of His kingdom. Daily it will be their prayer that the sanctification of the Sabbath may rest upon them. Every day they will have the companionship of Christ and will exemplify the perfection of His character. Every day their light will shine forth to others in good works.
quote:
We should jealously guard the edges of the Sabbath. Remember that every moment is consecrated, holy time. Whenever it is possible, employers should give their workers the hours from Friday noon until the beginning of the Sabbath. Give them time for preparation, that they may welcome the Lord's day with quietness of mind. By such a course you will suffer no loss even in temporal things.
Oh what a Wonderful God we server who cares so much for us He has given us such blessed words to help us. Amen!!! Below is a link to the comlete chapter with the above quotes for those to read who might not have access to books....This was taken from Testimonies for the Church, Volume 6 - By Ellen White - Messenger of God!!! ![[Pray or Praying or Prayer]](graemlins/pray.gif)
The Observance Of The Sabbath
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