|
Forums118
Topics9,199
Posts195,619
Members1,323
| |
Most Online5,850
Feb 29th, 2020
|
|
|
S |
M |
T |
W |
T |
F |
S |
|
|
|
|
1
|
2
|
3
|
4
|
|
5
|
6
|
7
|
8
|
9
|
10
|
11
|
|
12
|
13
|
14
|
15
|
16
|
17
|
18
|
|
19
|
20
|
21
|
22
|
23
|
24
|
25
|
|
26
|
27
|
28
|
29
|
30
|
31
|
|
|
|
Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
|
|
|
5 registered members (Karen Y, dedication, Nadi, 2 invisible),
3,495
guests, and 14
spiders. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75040
07/08/06 10:50 PM
07/08/06 10:50 PM
|
|
|
Well, we can ask the question all we want. Truth is the Jesus did not come to die for our sins. There was no need for Him to die. It is impossible for the originator of life to die.
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75041
07/08/06 11:44 PM
07/08/06 11:44 PM
|
SDA
Active Member 2014
Veteran Member
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 936
Quebec
|
|
Hello Mark, thank you for your kind greeting in another post.
Unborrowed life. The fuller context of this quotation, often lifted from Desire of Ages 530, is found in 1 Selected Messages 296-7.
"In Him was life, original, unborrowed, underived. This life is not inherent in man. He can possess it only through Christ. He can not earn it; it is given him as a free gift if he will believe in Christ as His personal Saviour. "This is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent" (John 17:3). This is the open fountain of life for the world." - Originally in Signs of the Times, April 8, 1897. One year before Desire of Ages.
Thus said, all the redeemed will have 'life original, unborrowed underived'. Am I misquoting Ellen White? How readest thou brethren?
"He can possess it only through Christ"..."This is the open fountain of life for the world". Unless this writing has been tampered with (always a possibility), I believe she is declaring that this is the gospel message of salvation.
Therefore, by her defintion, if we are not preaching the hope of "life, original, unborrowed, underived" for every repenting sinner, we are shutting the "fountain of life for the world", and will be weighed in the balances and found wanting. Have we missed the boat? - Surely we need to study some more.
Gordon
Last edited by gordonb1; 07/09/06 12:59 AM.
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75042
07/08/06 11:58 PM
07/08/06 11:58 PM
|
OP
SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2020
4500+ Member
|
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
|
|
Kubuli, we make every effort here to keep an open mind but you've crossed the line. We cannot tolerate that kind of expression here which the majority of our members and the moderators and staff unanimously view as error and worse. For clarity you cannot express those thoughts - "Jesus did not come to die for our sins" - and while we are try to err of the side of good will, you may not be warned again. I haven't consulted with the rest of the staff, but I expect I have their support, if not on the consequences, at a minimum on their opinion of your statement.
It's no accident in my view that someone with your manners holds these views. I don't say that in insult. You’re a valuable person in God's sight. I'm hoping you'll see the connection between the two. For now, I hope you'll refrain from a biting reply, review your posts and take some time to reflect.
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75043
07/09/06 12:15 AM
07/09/06 12:15 AM
|
Full Member
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 149
USA
|
|
Quote:
Well, we can ask the question all we want. Truth is the Jesus did not come to die for our sins. There was no need for Him to die. It is impossible for the originator of life to die.
Kubuli
I must say that the way you write, for this statement reminds me of another person by the screen name of "Darius" maybe you know him or you might be related?
If your theory is true then why did Christ come to this earth for? I am sure it was not for His pleasure.
The Bible (KJV) is very clear that Christ came to die the death that I should die. Of course this would be only if I am unrepentant and continue in the ways of darkness.
Your thoughts are very subversive and if my memory serves me correctly, you can find this line of thought in most “cosmic christ” teachings as well as “new age” teachings that hold hands with teachings of the Hindu gods.
There is also a hint of Kabala in your line of thought.
As a follower of Christ and the true word of God I must point these things out, for what you write goes against the Holy Word of God. I fear for some who may not yet be founded in the Word of God that you false teachings will lead them away from a plain thus saith the Lord.
I will pray to the one true God the Father of Christ that He will have mercy and lead you to the truth.
Peace and Grace
David
The greatest want of the world is the want of men-- men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true and honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty as the needle to the pole, men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall.
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75044
07/09/06 12:37 AM
07/09/06 12:37 AM
|
Full Member
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 149
USA
|
|
Quote:
John, Tom, she has a point though about unborrowed life. Let's think about this a bit more.
It may be we are misunderstanding what is meant by "unborrowed". Christ the only begotten Son of God would not borrow life would he? There would be no need for He is the Son of the one True God and as such He would have life in Him, even the breath of life. Is it so hard to understand that the Son of God does the prefect will of the Father and that the Father lived in the Son, and the Father did the works? John 14.
With this in mind, is it impossible to believe that Christ was given Life from the Father? We know that Scriptures teach that it was the Father that raised Christ from the Dead. This to can be found from the writings of Paul.
Christ did not borrow life it was given to Him by His Father or as Christ calls His Father in Revelation "His God".
The Father, has given everything to His son, read the S.O.P volume 1 first chapter "the fall of satan".
And read Prov 8:22-33, you will find that Christ was Gods daily delight and that Christ was brought forth from the Father.
We have borrowed life not the Son of God.
Peace and Grace
David
The greatest want of the world is the want of men-- men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true and honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty as the needle to the pole, men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall.
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75045
07/09/06 12:42 AM
07/09/06 12:42 AM
|
SDA
Active Member 2014
Veteran Member
|
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 936
Quebec
|
|
Thank you Dr. Kubuli/Darius for a theologian's perspective. I remain grateful that an old colporteur long gone warned the young men of the dangers at seminary.
From my reading, only the Father has immortality. "Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen. 1 Timothy 6:16.
The Son of God is differently described as that "which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life" 1 John 1:1.
The Son was ordained to die, "the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world." Revelation 13:8.
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75046
07/09/06 01:00 AM
07/09/06 01:00 AM
|
Dedicated Member
|
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,196
Ontario
|
|
Rosangela’s comments are contrary to the intended message, in regards to the life and death of Christ, and I disagree with them. EW never intended to portray that Christ did not die, but, to the contrary, that he did, and did not go anywhere else. When Lazarus was called forth, his spirit was not summoned down from heaven either. He was called forth out of the tomb. Christ never had/has his “own divinity”; his divinity is his Father. Gordon has given the proper perspective regarding the nature of the unborrowed life. But turning from all lesser representations, we behold God in Jesus. Looking unto Jesus we see that it is the glory of our God to give. "I do nothing of Myself," said Christ; "the living Father hath sent Me, and I live by the Father." "I seek not Mine own glory," but the glory of Him that sent Me. John 8:28; 6:57; 8:50; 7:18. In these words is set forth the great principle which is the law of life for the universe. All things Christ received from God, but He took to give. So in the heavenly courts, in His ministry for all created beings: through the beloved Son, the Father's life flows out to all; through the Son it returns, in praise and joyous service, a tide of love, to the great Source of all. And thus through Christ the circuit of beneficence is complete, representing the character of the great Giver, the law of life. DA21
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75047
07/09/06 01:40 AM
07/09/06 01:40 AM
|
OP
SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2020
4500+ Member
|
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
|
|
I should add Kubuli, it is one thing to be openly enquiring about a topic but another to be promoting an error that you're aware the forum has rejected. In the former case, we're open to all discussions with people who really are wavering between opinions. But if you're coming here to promote an error then this is another lesson in manners that you need to consider. For example I can't imagine going to a Roman Catholic site and making derogatory remarks about the pope. It is common courtesy to refrain from that kind of behaviour.
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75048
07/09/06 01:43 AM
07/09/06 01:43 AM
|
|
|
I would like to see the hands of anyone here who has a plan detailing what they will do if their child were to fall into a raging stream. The fact is you have no plan. Yet, I know that anything you will do is inherent in your love for that child even before the child is born. Language is a beautiful thing when properly comprehended.
Why did Jesus come to the earth? He came to rescue the human race and he did that through his life which countered the false views of the Creator that had been disseminated by the enemy. If he had come to die Herod offered a good chance that He passed up.
Gordon, if you are suggesting that Jesus is not equal to the Father you will have to take that up with someone else.
|
|
|
Re: What is the spirit of a man?
#75049
07/09/06 01:46 AM
07/09/06 01:46 AM
|
|
|
Quote:
I should add Kubuli, it is one thing to be openly enquiring about a topic but another to be promoting an error that you're aware the forum has rejected. In the former case, we're open to all discussions with people who really are wavering between opinions. But if you're coming here to promote an error then this is another lesson in manners that you need to consider. For example I can't imagine going to a Roman Catholic site and making derogatory remarks about the pope. It is common courtesy to refrain from that kind of behaviour.
I agree totally and would not do this knowingly. What is this error that the forum has rejected? I apologize for not having read the FAQ on that.
|
|
|
|
|
Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
|
|
|
