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Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: Tammy Roesch] #86550
03/17/07 09:37 PM
03/17/07 09:37 PM
Tammy Roesch  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 562
North East OHIO
I agree Cheri, "meat eating" and "lust" are connected together.


Christ is waiting with longing desire for the manifestation of Himself in His church. When the character of Christ shall be perfectly reproduced in His people, then He will come to claim them as His own. {COL 69}

Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: Tammy Roesch] #86553
03/17/07 10:04 PM
03/17/07 10:04 PM
Davros  Offline
Dedicated Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 1,009
Ohio
If eating meat is a sin, does that mean that Jesus sinned?

 Quote:
Later, the Lord again appeared to Abraham near the great trees of Mamre. Abraham was sitting at the entrance of his tent during the hottest part of the day. He looked up and saw three men standing near him. When Abraham saw them, he ran from his tent to meet them. He bowed facedown on the ground before them and said, "Sir, if you think well of me, please stay awhile with me, your servant. I will bring some water so all of you can wash your feet. You may rest under the tree, and I will get some bread for you so you can regain your strength. Then you may continue your journey." The three men said, "That is fine. Do as you said." Abraham hurried to the tent where Sarah was and said to her, "Hurry, prepare twenty quarts of fine flour, and make it into loaves of bread." Then Abraham ran to his herd and took one of his best calves. He gave it to a servant, who hurried to kill it and to prepare it for food. Abraham gave the three men the calf that had been cooked and milk curds and milk. While they ate, he stood under the tree near them.
Genesis 18:1-8 NCV


Oh Happy Day!
Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: Tammy Roesch] #86554
03/17/07 10:22 PM
03/17/07 10:22 PM
Redfog  Offline
Senior Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 733
Michigan, USA
So is every unhealthy activity a sin?


If at first you don't succeed.....destroy all evidence you ever tried.
Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: Redfog] #86555
03/17/07 10:58 PM
03/17/07 10:58 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
Here is something for you all to chew on:

Exo 12:8 And they shall eat the flesh in that night, roast with fire, and unleavened bread; and with bitter herbs they shall eat it.
Exo 12:9 Eat not of it raw, nor sodden at all with water, but roast with fire; his head with his legs, and with the purtenance thereof.
Exo 12:10 And ye shall let nothing of it remain until the morning; and that which remaineth of it until the morning ye shall burn with fire.
Exo 12:11 And thus shall ye eat it; with your loins girded, your shoes on your feet, and your staff in your hand; and ye shall eat it in haste: it is the LORD'S passover.


Num 9:8 And Moses said unto them, Stand still, and I will hear what the LORD will command concerning you.
Num 9:9 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
Num 9:10 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If any man of you or of your posterity shall be unclean by reason of a dead body, or be in a journey afar off, yet he shall keep the passover unto the LORD.
Num 9:11 The fourteenth day of the second month at even they shall keep it, and eat it with unleavened bread and bitter herbs.
Num 9:12 They shall leave none of it unto the morning, nor break any bone of it: according to all the ordinances of the passover they shall keep it.
Num 9:13 But the man that is clean, and is not in a journey, and forbeareth to keep the passover, even the same soul shall be cut off from among his people: because he brought not the offering of the LORD in his appointed season, that man shall bear his sin.
Num 9:14 And if a stranger shall sojourn among you, and will keep the passover unto the LORD; according to the ordinance of the passover, and according to the manner thereof, so shall he do: ye shall have one ordinance, both for the stranger, and for him that was born in the land.

Maybe this time someone will have something to say to this command.

So, quite contrary to what Cheri aluded to in her previous post saying: "So do you remember what happened when they arrived at Canaan? Can you believe this, they still wanted flesh to eat!" they would have sinned in persisting as vegetarians and would have been killed outside in the wilderness for rebellion if they had refused to eat the flesh of the lamb.

But I agree that it would be sin for Cheri and Tammy to eat meat for Paul wrote:

Rom 14:23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: vastergotland] #86556
03/17/07 11:03 PM
03/17/07 11:03 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
Cheri pointed out the sin of Israel in the desert. It was not eating birds, but

"Why?

1. “Because they believed not in God”
2. ”and trusted not in his salvation”
"


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: vastergotland] #86557
03/17/07 11:17 PM
03/17/07 11:17 PM
Cheri Fritz  Offline OP
Full Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 278
Gloversville, NY, USA
-continued

Why is our Savior still in heaven today?
  • Acts 3:19-21 “Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord; And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.”
What does it say?
  1. Repent
  2. Be converted, so your sins may be blotted out so we may receive the Holy Spirit
  3. Christ is in heaven waiting
  4. for the times of restitution of all things
Truly our Lord is calling us to be prepared to live in heaven today as He has said in Matthew 16:19 “And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.” Yes, what we do here on earth is what we will be doing in heaven.

Will there be sin? Will there be lust? Will there be coveting? Will there examples of killing? Will we kill for our taste buds? Will we kill for our needs? No.

God is calling us to restore His good ways.
  • Jeremiah 6:16 “Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein.”
Today we are being called to be Christ’s representatives in all that we do, for we are to be the examples of the believers (1 Tim 4:12).
  • 2 Corinthians 5:20 “Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.”
And what do we know about being a faithful representative?
  • Proverbs 13:17 A wicked messenger falleth into mischief: but a faithful ambassador is health.”
In closing, I am brought back to recall how I would spend days preparing my home for special company. I attended to every last detail which I could think of. Is this not what we should be doing for the bodies which God has loaned us, for are not our bodies His property?
  • 1 Corinthians 3:16, 17 “Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.”
  • 1 Corinthians 6:19,20 “What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.”
Daily some may experience much unrest in health. Truly sickness is not rest to our souls. But our God has promised us rest for our souls.

And how do we find rest?
  • Jeremiah 6:16 “Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls….”
  • Matthew 11:28, 29 “Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.”
God wants us healthy! 3 John 1:2 “Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.” He does not want our souls to have leanness, but wants to bless us.
  • Exodus 15:26 “And said, If thou wilt diligently hearken to the voice of the LORD thy God, and wilt do that which is right in his sight, and wilt give ear to his commandments, and keep all his statutes, I will put none of these diseases upon thee, which I have brought upon the Egyptians: for I am the LORD that healeth thee.”
It took time for me to have faith in the last verse, but truly when we do God’s will He presents us prosperity with health. Don’t you find it odd that a Christian would have doubts? You see, God is taking the time to education us in His school of heavenly living. He has provided even our faith so long as we are willing to lay down everything and to follow His principles because we love Him. Truly our Creator knew something about our magnificent machinery when He created us, shouldn’t we trust the owner’s manual and its author? It is something to consider isn’t it?

With love,
Your Sister in Christ Jesus,
Cheri


"Why is it so hard to lead a self-denying, humble life? Because professed Christians are not dead to the world. It is easy living after we are dead." 1T 131.2
Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: Cheri Fritz] #86558
03/18/07 12:10 AM
03/18/07 12:10 AM
Will  Offline
Most Dedicated Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,332
BC, Canada
God is not a minister of sin. He doesn't say that it's Ok to eat meat then tell you that it's a sin after people have been eating it.
I don't find any thing evil or sinful about eating meat, and I still didn't get my question answered.
Is the purpose of this "study" to tell us that eating meat is a sin.
Yes or no.
WIll

Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: Will] #86559
03/18/07 12:13 AM
03/18/07 12:13 AM
Will  Offline
Most Dedicated Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,332
BC, Canada
I gather that is the gist of the study "Jesus is still in heaven cause people are eating meat"
What a joke.. I don't eat meat, but this is over the top. Shall we grow beards, keep the feast days cause Christ isn't hear yet.
Unbelieveable, unbiblical, and clearly hypocritical. THis is what is called a lie, vegetariansim taugt to be the way to holiness, yet Christ ate meat... Oh boy.. what next?

Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: Will] #86560
03/18/07 12:21 AM
03/18/07 12:21 AM
Will  Offline
Most Dedicated Member
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 2,332
BC, Canada
Also keep in mind that God used Daniel extensively, and this man ate and drank wine. Or was it not flesh food he ate? Again God is not a God of confusion.
The real health message is to be healthy, so we can go and tell others about Christ's soon return, not "Eat only broccoli so you can go to heaven". We cannot do that if we are always getting sick, which by the way getting sick is not a sin, its a result of sin in the world. Something to think about.
WIll

Re: A Bible Study on Vegetarianism [Re: Cheri Fritz] #86561
03/18/07 12:33 AM
03/18/07 12:33 AM
G
gordonb1  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2014

Veteran Member
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 936
Quebec
God has given further direction for His people in these last days. Not only is dead flesh to be avoided, but cheese, milk and eggs will be discarded. I agree with Sister Roesch, consumption of flesh and animal products increases lust and jeopardizes self-control. Any intemperance or indulgence of appetite has this effect. Paradise can be lost through appetite, as Adam and Eve discovered and even Esau over his lentil stew.

Those who indulge appetite are often apparent by their combative spirit, quick to speak, quick to wrath, eager for a fight or to defend self. The works of the flesh are manifest, but the fruits of the Spirit are wanting.

Through Ellen White, God has repeatedly warned His people to avoid consuming dead flesh, most especially those who minister in the Word. There is no room for doubt in these numerous and strong statements. It will be called legalism by those who doubt God's care for His children.

We are not responsible for fulfilling the Old Testament practices, but the Day of Atonement in antitype. The Adventist movement was raised for this very purpose, to proclaim the Day of Atonement and the mediation of Christ before God in the heavenly sanctuary, to remove our sins from the ledger before probation closes. This is the purpose of the three angels message, of which Health Reform is the right arm.

As Thomas indicates above, sin is not believing in God, not trusting Him to save us from our depraved appetites. (The lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life - 1 John 2:16) Ellen White makes the distinction that both physical and moral decay result from flesh eating. Many of us are ready to doubt this advice and throw contempt upon the prophet of God's own choosing. Ellen White is dead and unaffected by the ridicule, but Jehovah registers every slight made against the messengers of His appointment. We are all responsible for our influence. I write this not for those who desire a battle, but for some who may be unsure of God's instruction for these last days.

"Wherefore if meat make my brother to offend, I will eat no flesh while the world standeth, lest I make my brother to offend." 1 Corinthians 8:13.

Gordon

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