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Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: Daryl] #95536
02/10/08 08:33 PM
02/10/08 08:33 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
What wiki article is that?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinosaurs#Size


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: vastergotland] #95538
02/10/08 08:48 PM
02/10/08 08:48 PM
Daryl  Offline

Site Administrator
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,122
Nova Scotia, Canada
From what I read there in that link, it seems that there are two definitions of what is a dinosaur:
 Quote:

Original definition
The taxon Dinosauria was formally named in 1842 by English palaeontologist Richard Owen, who used it to refer to the "distinct tribe or sub-order of Saurian Reptiles" that were then being recognized in England and around the world.[1] The term is derived from the Greek words δεινός (deinos meaning "terrible", "fearsome", or "formidable") and σαύρα (saura meaning "lizard" or "reptile"). Though the taxonomic name has often been interpreted as a reference to dinosaurs' teeth, claws, and other fearsome characteristics, Owen intended it merely to evoke their size and majesty.[2]

Modern definition

Triceratops skeleton at the American Museum of Natural History in New York City.Under phylogenetic taxonomy, dinosaurs are usually defined as all descendants of the most recent common ancestor of Triceratops and modern birds.[3] It has also been suggested that Dinosauria be defined as all of the descendants of the most recent common ancestor of Megalosaurus and Iguanodon, because these were two of the three genera cited by Richard Owen when he recognized the Dinosauria.[4] Both definitions result in the same set of animals being defined as dinosaurs, including theropods (mostly bipedal carnivores), sauropodomorphs (mostly large herbivorous quadrupeds with long necks and tails), ankylosaurians (armored herbivorous quadrupeds), stegosaurians (plated herbivorous quadrupeds), ceratopsians (herbivorous quadrupeds with horns and frills), and ornithopods (bipedal or quadrupedal herbivores including "duck-bills"). These definitions are written to correspond with scientific conceptions of dinosaurs that predate the modern use of phylogenetics. The continuity of meaning is intended to prevent confusion about what the term "dinosaur" means.

Did you notice the date of the original definition? The date of the original definition of dinosaur was 1842, therefore, it would make sense to me that EGW in her writings had this definition in mind.


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: Daryl] #95540
02/10/08 09:01 PM
02/10/08 09:01 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
 Originally Posted By: Daryl Fawcett
From what I read there in that link, it seems that there are two definitions of what is a dinosaur:

Did you notice the date of the original definition? The date of the original definition of dinosaur was 1842, therefore, it would make sense to me that EGW in her writings had this definition in mind.

We would first have to establish that Ellen was talking about dinosaurs at all. The word "dinosaur" produces no hits at all in the ellenwhite search library.


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: vastergotland] #95541
02/10/08 09:01 PM
02/10/08 09:01 PM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
 Quote:
In the paragraph about size in the wiki article, we read that: "A rough estimate for average dinosaur weight is about 100 kilograms (200 lb)." That is not very different from the average adult human weight.

Right, and Ellen White mentions specifically that a class of very large animals perished at the flood, so we can't affirm that the smaller ones also died in the flood. However, as I said, the extinction of all the suborders, and infraorders, and families, and species of dinosaurs is very intriguing. There is no other instance of such occurrence in the whole animal kingdom.

Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: vastergotland] #95542
02/10/08 09:06 PM
02/10/08 09:06 PM
Rosangela  Offline
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
 Quote:
The curse does not say that plants which previously did not have thorns now would have such. The curse says that thorny plants and thistles would grow in wheat fields. Adam will farm the ground and wish for cereals and vegetables but "all" he will see is the thorns and thistles. If we see this to mean that God created thorns and thistles to plauge Adam, I think we are reading more into the text than is there.

I've never heard of thorny plants and thistles growing in wheat fields, just of tares. Besides, Ellen White is clear that it was not God who created thorns and thistles.

Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: Rosangela] #95543
02/10/08 09:06 PM
02/10/08 09:06 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
Not so sure that you are correct there Rosangela. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Animal_extinction#Mass_extinctions
Dinosaurs simply seem to be the most known example of a whole order of animals disapearing. If indeed it did disapear entierly. As was quoted earlier, birds are thought to be a branch of dinosaurs, and what about crocodiles?


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: Rosangela] #95545
02/10/08 09:10 PM
02/10/08 09:10 PM
V
vastergotland  Offline
Active Member 2011
3500+ Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
 Originally Posted By: Rosangela
 Quote:
The curse does not say that plants which previously did not have thorns now would have such. The curse says that thorny plants and thistles would grow in wheat fields. Adam will farm the ground and wish for cereals and vegetables but "all" he will see is the thorns and thistles. If we see this to mean that God created thorns and thistles to plauge Adam, I think we are reading more into the text than is there.

I've never heard of throny plants and thistles growing in wheat fields. Besides, Ellen White is clear that it was not God who created them.
Go ask a local farmer what he is trying to kill with the plant poisons he sprays his fields with every year.

If God did not create a whole family of plants that anyone can see does exist, then it is no longer true that "All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being."


Galatians 2
21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

It is so hazardous to take here a little and there a little. If you put the right little's together you can make the bible teach anything you wish. //Graham Maxwell
Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: vastergotland] #95546
02/10/08 09:25 PM
02/10/08 09:25 PM
Tom  Offline
Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
 Quote:
If God did not create a whole family of plants that anyone can see does exist, then it is no longer true that "All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being."


Rosangela wasn't saying that God didn't create the plants, but that He didn't create the thorns and thistles. Actually Rosangela said this is what Ellen White wrote.

Here's EGW's statement again:

 Quote:
Christ never planted the seeds of death in the system. Satan planted these seeds when he tempted Adam to eat of the tree of knowledge which meant disobedience to God. Not one noxious plant was placed in the Lord's great garden, but after Adam and Eve sinned, poisonous herbs sprang up. In the parable of the sower the question was asked the master, "Didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?" The master answered, "An enemy hath done this" (Matthew 13:27, 28). All tares are sown by the evil one. Every noxious herb is of his sowing, and by his ingenious methods of amalgamation he has corrupted the earth with tares. (2SM 288)


It seems to me that Rosangela's explanation is a fair reading of the above.


Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: vastergotland] #95547
02/10/08 09:31 PM
02/10/08 09:31 PM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
The text says that many species became extinct, not, as I said, all the suborders, and infraorders, and families, and species of a superorder.
That idea of taxonomists of classifying a sparrow as a dinosaur is hilarious. I think it's more reasonable to say that the class of archosaurs includes the subclasses crocodilians, pterosaurs, thecodonts, dinosaurs and birds.

Re: Is the story of the world wide flood a parabel or reality? [Re: Rosangela] #95548
02/10/08 09:36 PM
02/10/08 09:36 PM
Rosangela  Offline
5500+ Member
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
I had edited the post (about thorns and thistles) to clarify what I meant. I was going to reply to post #95545, but I see Tom has already done that for me. Thanks, Tom.

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